Episode 1000622230842

0:54 Voiceover Loveline may contain sexually oriented content. The listener discretion is advised.

1:08 Adam Dr. Drew, board certified physician, addiction medicine specialist. Tonight, an interesting show. Dr. Bruce Hensel's here tonight. He's a medical journalist for NBC, and also for many, many, many years. Well, I don't mean that in a bad way, but you know what I'm saying. I know you're from the TV is what I'm trying to say.

1:28 Guest Strikers already put me up there with the Staples, not Staples Center, but the Staples with Hal Fishman, I think I'm on.

1:34 Adam Oh yeah.

1:35 Guest Been around that long.

1:35 Adam Hell, I toss you in with Dumphy too.

1:38 Guest His name did come up, by the way.

1:41 Drew Oh yeah, yeah.

1:41 Adam He's been dead for a few years now, that's the problem.

1:43 Drew We went and talked about Staples and then no Staples. Oh, those Lakers.

1:48 Adam Oh, Staples Center, yeah. Yeah, by the way, well, all right, I was driving in. I saw the big go Lakers thing on the Staples Center thing, which is, look, they lost two hours ago. Someone's got to hop on that sign.

2:01 Drew They just love it.

2:02 Adam Let's go, people.

2:03 Drew It wasn't a cliffhanger either.

2:05 Adam No, 25 points. Also, Rene is in here now. Rene is the subject of a documentary called The Opposite Sex, Rene's Story. A very interesting story.

2:20 Drew Drew, tell it. Well, I meant Rene, tell it.

2:23 Adam All right, Rene, you tell it. By the way, it's on Showtime. It's currently airing on Showtime, and you can go to www.show, I should say, sho.com to find out airing times. Yes.

2:37 Drew This is a topic that comes up on the show periodically. We've been wanting to dig in.

2:39 Adam Gender reassignment.

2:40 Drew Yeah, and so Rene has had this experience, so you're on.

2:45 Guest Okay, what is it that you're?

2:46 Drew Your story.

2:49 Guest Well, since I was three years old, about three, well, actually at three, I told my mother that I was a boy and we kind of argued and I said to her that if I wasn't physically on the outside, that my, that God would make me one. And pretty much in my life have not ever turned back from that statement.

3:12 Adam So where'd you grow up, by the way?

3:14 Guest I grew up in Fort Worth, Texas.

3:16 Adam And you started off, just for the sake of clarity, you started off a female. I mean, when you were three, you had female genitalia.

3:25 Guest Yeah, I would never say I started off female.

3:27 Adam I know, but here's the problem. If we get into semantics, it's gonna get confusing for people that are listening. So just for the sake of the people listening at home, a lot of them stoned, quite frankly, and drunk behind the wheel.

3:42 Drew Makes it that much worse.

3:43 Adam Which is our key demographic, the drunk driver. We'll just say started off as, currently, and that kind of stuff. It'll get confusing otherwise. So started off a female, told your mom at three, you were not one, you were male, and sorry, continue.

4:01 Guest Correct. And just by the time I was 11, just started beginning to step into the role of what it was I felt inside, and pretty much I've lived that way my entire life.

4:16 Drew So at 11, let's say now you're adolescent, are you attracted to males or females?

4:21 Guest At this particular time, I'm not really attracted to anyone.

4:24 Drew At the point at which you start getting attracted to other people, males or females?

4:28 Guest Females.

4:28 Drew Attracted to females. And do people, do you have a problem with that at that point? Do people start calling you lesbian? Do you start feeling like there's some confusion, or do you still think to yourself, I'm just a male, and people don't, were you dressing as a male at that point? Yes. Did people think you were male?

4:45 Guest Pretty much for the most part.

4:47 Drew So when you would go, would you go out with girls in high school?

4:51 Guest Yes.

4:52 Drew And they didn't know you had female genitalia?

4:54 Guest No.

4:55 Adam Same with me, actually.

4:57 Drew They didn't know you had female genitalia?

4:58 Adam Yeah, they had a suspicion.

5:00 Guest Or you went out with females.

5:01 Guest There was one episode, actually, when Rene's mom took him over to his girlfriend's house and pulled his shirt up to prove that he was female to her. Biologically female, even though he had a girlfriend and felt like he was a male. His mom exposed him to his girlfriend.

5:19 Adam Yeah, you should have seen that one coming, by the way. You never, when the mom or dad says, let's head over to the girlfriend's house.

5:27 Drew How old were you when that happened?

5:28 Adam Yeah, when did that happen?

5:29 Guest About 14.

5:30 Drew Was your mom abusive, generally?

5:32 Guest No.

5:32 Drew That's a pretty abusive thing to do. Not pretty abusive, profoundly abusive.

5:37 Adam Well, maybe she was looking for a little shock therapy or something, thought she was gonna snap him out of it or something like that. I mean, but people, people, their ways are loving, but crude oftentimes, you know? Do you have brothers and sisters?

5:51 Guest I do, I'm the baby of four. I have one brother and two sisters.

5:54 Adam How do they do with the whole thing?

5:59 Guest Okay, I guess. I mean, now, it's been pretty rough road traveling, probably as much for them as me, and I've-

6:08 Adam And what about your father? Is he around?

6:10 Guest No.

6:10 Adam So he's out of the picture.

6:12 Guest Yeah, he was a loser from the beginning.

6:13 Adam So your mom is, your mom's a working mother, and you have two siblings. You're the youngest. And now you're in high school, you're dressing as a male, you're passing yourself as a male, but what happens for like gym class and stuff like that?

6:32 Guest I just hit it well. That's pretty much all I can say.

6:36 Adam There's nothing, they don't mark anything down on your, you know, card or your file. There's nothing in the file. Do you know what I mean? I mean-

6:43 Drew You know, well, listen, public high school?

6:45 Guest Public high school.

6:46 Drew Public high school.

6:47 Adam There we go. I went to North Hollywood High, they didn't even care what you were.

6:53 Guest Well, I got kicked out of a couple of them, you know. Really? I was born and raised in Texas and Texasers, you know.

7:00 Adam So you would go to gym, you would go to the gym and stuff, you just wouldn't shower. That kind of stuff, right?

7:06 Guest Yeah, I got by with it. It's not really hard to hide yourself and, you know.

7:12 Drew And why'd you get kicked out of high schools?

7:15 Guest Somehow it always got brought up, the situation always got brought up.

7:19 Drew And that got you kicked out?

7:20 Guest Got me kicked out, yeah. In the 80s, it wasn't real liberal and...

7:24 Adam Weird. Now, did you have people that knew you as a female from the past? I mean, like guys you went to grade school with who followed you into high school, who ratted you out?

7:35 Guest No. No, we probably moved around too much for that. I like, my early years were in Denton and then my later years were in Fort Worth.

7:44 Drew Why are you moving so much?

7:46 Guest Just my mom was a mover. Pretty much like a waitressy and that kind of thing.

7:55 Drew Did you feel yourself to be her caretaker early on? No.

8:00 Guest No, no, but there was a certain point where she probably, I didn't feel she was my caretaker either.

8:06 Drew She parentalized you?

8:08 Adam Yeah. So just pushing the hoop ahead here. So now you're in high school, you're having a little trouble, but you're fooling 95% of the people, right? You're doing a decent job, by the way.

8:22 Guest Pretty much.

8:22 Adam And now you meet a woman. Is it you meet your girlfriend soon to be wife or eventually to become wife in high school?

8:33 Guest No.

8:34 Adam No, you meet her out after high school.

8:35 Guest I met her while she was in high school, but I was already out of high school.

8:38 Adam Smart, that's what I'm gonna do in about 10 years. I forget about 10 years on my wife and then pow, I go back to high school as a woman, Drew. And meet the next Mrs. Corolla. Good job. Yeah, I'm gonna need a note from you, by the way. Oh, we'll get into this off the air. I got all work out, Bruce. Hang out, we need to talk too. This will work from you. All right, so you get out of high school, now you're just taking jobs. What, do you have a profession or are you just floating around?

9:05 Guest Just kind of at that point floating around, not really knowing what I want to do.

9:09 Adam Right, and now how old are you when you meet your girlfriend?

9:13 Guest 20.

9:14 Adam You're 20, she's in high school and you guys have a relationship for 12 years.

9:20 Guest 14.

9:20 Adam 14 years, all right.

9:22 Drew That brings us up to today? So you have had for 14 years.

9:26 Adam All right, maybe this is, the bio's a little old or something. So you have a 14 year relationship. She doesn't know you're biologically a woman?

9:36 Guest Not true, she knew. She knew. She knew that I had breast three days into the relationship. She knew that I was transsexual. I mean, she was the actual first person that I ever said, hey, I was born this way.

9:48 Adam Right, and she considers herself heterosexual.

9:51 Guest Correct.

9:52 Drew How did she deal with the original reveal?

9:55 Guest How'd that go?

9:58 Guest Well, originally, how she dealt with it was pretty good. How she dealt with it 12 years later was-

10:03 Guest Really?

10:04 Guest What was the shocking. Really?

10:05 Drew How later it got bad?

10:06 Guest Yeah, well, it got bad. After the church kicked this out, it got pretty.

10:13 Adam By the way, that's one of my things in my list. I don't have that list of having my hands registered.

10:18 Drew You want to kick it out of the church?

10:19 Adam And then, yeah, and jumping into a body water with a knife in my mouth.

10:22 Drew Yeah, yeah, yeah.

10:22 Adam I want to be tossed out of a church.

10:24 Drew Not from the congregation. Physically church.

10:26 Adam Physically, like a bar.

10:27 Drew Yeah, yeah, thrown out by big guys.

10:29 Adam Thrown out onto the street. Yeah, and then have them do this with their hands as they head back in. Yeah, all right, so you're, okay. So now, let's see, you've been together for a long time. Now you're looking to get the gender reassignment, right? I mean, you're looking to get the surgery.

10:47 Drew Before you go on this real quick, I just want to say for callers, but we like to kind of stay close to this topic not as much as possible. We'll take the usual Loveline calls too.

10:53 Adam Really?

10:54 Drew Yeah, all right. But just, you know, the call in with, if you have questions about these kinds of things, if you've had issues yourself, Rene and Bruce know a lot about this topic and they can answer your questions or if you have questions for them, because I know we've had a million.

11:05 Adam Yeah.

11:05 Drew And it was just never ending.

11:06 Adam Well, we had Dr. Alter on here, which is somebody you guys must have come across at some point.

11:12 Guest Actually, in the other movie we, Gary Alter is the doctor in the male to female that we did, which is Jamie's story. He was not the doctor for Rene, but he was the doctor for Jamie's story, which is the other movie.

11:27 Adam Yeah, well, the male to female seems like a much more common procedure than the female to male.

11:33 Guest Yeah, it's more common for a lot of reasons. First of all, the estrogen that they take at first is much weaker than testosterone. Second of all, the surgeries are very good, so a lot more go through with that surgery.

11:43 Drew Yeah, another quick aside, Bruce and I had talked about how much we both agree that testosterone is a drug. And that when you take somebody and put the money in for testosterone, it changes them substantially.

11:55 Guest When we first met Rene, one of the reasons I thought about not having him in the movie when we were first looking for our subject was he already looked so male, we were afraid we wouldn't have a visual arc. But once we heard he and Juana's story, it was a no-brainer because it was so deep, so profound.

12:10 Drew And Juana's the wife.

12:11 Guest Right. Juana's the wife.

12:12 Adam Okay, so yeah, you could never tell Rene started as anything other than a male. But you, so now you're, well, I don't even, did you undergo the surgery?

12:25 Guest Yes.

12:25 Adam So you had the reassignment surgery, and that was how long ago?

12:29 Guest About close to two and a half years ago.

12:31 Adam And when did you get started on the hormone therapy?

12:35 Guest When I was 22.

12:36 Adam All right, and how does that work? Do you just go talk to a doctor? Do you have insurance coverage?

12:42 Do you save up money?

12:42 Adam Is it expensive?

12:43 Yeah.

12:45 Guest You mean for which part? For the testosterone?

12:47 Adam Just getting started, yeah.

12:49 Drew What other parts are there for testosterone?

12:51 Guest Well, you know, for some people, before they even can start testosterone or estrogen, whichever is the case, they have to go through years of therapy. That wasn't the case for me. I met with a therapist for about 45 minutes and everything else kind of fell into place from that point.

13:13 Adam And so then you go talk to a doctor that does this and you begin the therapy, you begin the estrogen therapy, or I'm sorry, testosterone therapy with like a note from the therapist. You have to get a stain stamp, yes, I'm sorry, stain stamp like on something. I need one of those too, by the way, Drew.

13:31 Drew No possibility.

13:33 Guest Yeah, you, they, I think that the many different people may want to put themselves into a category of transsexuality. I think that people have different reasons for it. Some people were actually like me, feel they were born in the wrong body and it starts at a very young age, but different people have different reasons for doing it. And so, because of that, some people are required to go through years and years and years of-

14:00 Adam Right, but I mean, do you have to present something to the doctor who begins this therapy with you?

14:05 Guest Well, yeah, sure, sure. I mean, the doctor that's going into it has to know that you know what you're doing.

14:12 Drew It's just a communication from the therapist?

14:14 Guest You know, it's a white-

14:15 Adam Yeah, I'm talking about like a protocol here, an official protocol, not an emotional, not a state of mind.

14:21 Guest The Harry Benjamin standards?

14:22 Guest Yeah, you know, they're the Harry Benjamin standards for gender reassignment, but it's not a-

14:27 Adam What is that?

14:27 Guest Who is that?

14:28 Guest Harry Benjamin is an association, was one of the therapists who treated Christine Jorgensen, who was the first transsexual to actually have surgery in 1954, who believe it or not had more print written about it than any UNV up till that point. But that's not a strict protocol. What you get is, I mean, let's talk about reality here. What you get, some people get to hormone specialists, endocrinologists, without ever going through therapy and the hormone therapists give them the hormones. Just like people can get other drugs. Some people go to a therapist, then get to the hormone therapist. But almost all of them need to go through what's called an RLT, real life transition, where they take the hormone for a certain period of time and dresses the opposite sex before the surgeon will consider them for the surgery.

15:10 Adam So the big step is the surgery part, not the hormone part.

15:13 Guest Well, some people think, you know, we do a panel after the movies to talk to other people because there are different paths from Rene. Some people stop short of the surgery. The surgery is not the answer for everything.

15:23 Drew A lot of the males do, right?

15:24 Guest A lot of the female to males do. They get such a physical change with the testosterone and the surgeries are so lousy in some cases that some people stop. And you know, there's something that came up before that I want to bring up to you and to the audience. Who you're attracted to and who you feel like inside. Gender and sex are two completely different things. I've met people who wanted to be women who were biologically male who were attracted to women, the same who were attracted to men. I've met women who were attracted to men but wanted to be biologically male. I met one man who wanted to be, I met a woman who wanted to become a man. It's hard to keep the pronoun straight sometimes.

15:59 Adam I'm not sure if I should get a boner or not. I'm all over the map.

16:02 Guest Well, that's a little worrisome overall.

16:04 Adam Yeah, well, thankfully my reaction time isn't what it used to be. So we're cool as long as you keep moving fast.

16:09 Guest This woman wanted to be a man, but wanted to be a gay man, so didn't want the surgery. So she was a woman biologically, but stayed a woman biologically to live with a man. So gender and sex. With a gay man.

16:21 Drew When the patients I've treated, I've treated a lot of them, male to female transitions, about 80% of them did so to have lesbian relationships with females.

16:30 Guest Absolutely. And in the male to female, the numbers are very different. They're almost reversed. But it's not a catch-all. It's very different for everybody. But what I learned in the course of making this movie over two years is that sex and gender are two different things. Who you feel like and who you're attracted to are not always something that's in concert.

16:50 Guest Well, that's because we don't what people don't understand about transsexualities. I didn't change my body so that I could go out with a woman. If I was a lesbian, I would be like, hey, I'm a lesbian. I don't give a **** what you think. Right. But that's not the case. I was a man born inside of a woman's body, and that caused me problems. And I didn't change over into this body so that I could go out with women. I changed over into this body so that my outside and inside come together.

17:18 Adam Well, let me ask you this. Your wife, who is not a lesbian, at least that wasn't her sexual proclivity, hadn't. Been with women before you and presumably had been with men before you. And now you guys engage in what would be, I guess, considered lesbian intercourse, right? I mean, before the surgery.

17:53 Guest No.

17:54 Adam No.

17:54 Guest No.

17:56 Guest Why would you consider lesbian intercourse? But some people might consider it that.

18:00 Drew Well, I mean, the same action that a lesbian would go through, the same physical action.

18:04 Guest But no, I mean, she never physically touched me.

18:09 Adam No oral sex?

18:10 Guest No.

18:10 Adam It's a deal breaker.

18:11 Guest Nobody did.

18:12 Adam That's a deal breaker.

18:13 Guest You also said that nobody had ever seen you naked.

18:15 Guest Nobody had ever seen me naked, including my wife, until after the surgery. So I'm a very, like, rare case.

18:23 Adam Well, what's going on with her? I mean, this seems like, I mean, you know, I'm sure she's in love with you, but at a certain point, you want to see your partner naked, don't you?

18:34 Drew Yeah, but only she gets to oral sex. This is something you need to rig up in your life.

18:38 Adam Oh, I see. All right. I'm slowly getting back on board with this.

18:43 Guest As a man, you don't understand what a woman goes through sexually, just like as a woman. She doesn't understand what a man goes through.

18:52 Adam I know there's a difference, but this is pretty far off the charts. You know what I mean? I mean, there's fluctuation and there's variability and everything, but this not seeing your partner in the nude for 14 years or 12 years before the surgery or whatever it is, is way, way off the charts.

19:11 Guest Well, yeah. I mean, I can understand where you're coming from, but being in the relationship, I don't know that I agree with where you're coming from. I just can understand what you're saying.

19:21 Guest Well, when we first met Rene and Juana, originally I was thinking we can't use Rene because he looks too male already. But when we heard their story, basically for Juana, this was a confusing, awakening time for her. She felt that up until the time that their church discovers that Rene is going to go ahead and have the surgery, she's able to live with it. Once the church finds out, throws them out, they start having trouble. Rene starts having issues, which Juana starts having issues, which Rene has one view of, which Juana has another view of. She starts feeling like she's not so sure. This is where she wants to be. Rene starts feeling like she's abandoning him, and that's part of what happens in front of the camera. It's an issue for both of them. For her, she's very young when she met Rene. She meets Rene. She lives with him. She's very much in love with him. And then when he has the surgery, things change. When he decides he's going to have the surgery, everything changes.

20:14 Adam Who dropped the dime on you at church?

20:18 Guest Actually, I dropped the dime on myself. Oh, really? It came out. Well, my wife's brother and his wife were kind of troublemakers and went to some people in the church that they knew were going to gossip and told them that I was really a woman. And from that point, it just kind of snowballed and I had somebody come to me. And when they come to me, I said, well, yeah, this is true. And let me explain to you. And so at this point, I went to the pastor of the church, which was a really close, I thought, friend of mine and say, here's what's going on and here's what's happening. And so he feeds me a load of crock when it's just me and him. So he was literally afraid I was going to be.

21:08 Adam We can't say the S word. I know it seems like he should be able to on this show, but it'd be very, it'd be very bizarre. I'm just picturing Rene beating the ass out of me. Unacceptable. Being very confused. It's really, you know, it takes a while. It's like some sort of altitude you have to adjust to with the he or she or he started as and went back or female to male, male to male.

21:39 Drew I want to pull a chalkboard always. I think this goes the other way.

21:43 Adam I need some form of a graph. So you, so let's get to the surgery part. You had the surgery and it worked. I mean, it came out. You're satisfied with the product?

21:59 Guest I don't know that I'm 100% satisfied, but I'm a whole lot better than where I was. I'm whole.

22:03 Drew They make it on your forearm?

22:05 Guest Oh no, no, no, no.

22:06 Guest You know, there are two types of surgery. There's one called a phalloplasty where you take tissue from elsewhere. The problem with that is although it's large, it doesn't have sensation. Another one is where you build it up from inside. It's called a metoideplasty. Rene had a variation of that was an experimental procedure. The problem with the metoideplasty is you don't get very much tissue. With the phalloplasty, you don't get much sensation. The surgeries are weak and Rene got an experimental one, which is a little bit, you know, Rene not only wanted to be a spokesperson for transgenders, he obviously can express himself very well and is charismatic, but he was willing to be a guinea pig who really underwent an experimental procedure because he feels he wants to help others to reach out to people who don't know about it.

22:48 Adam Well, so it wasn't a total success or there wasn't the satisfaction levels, not what it could be.

22:54 Guest I think Rene.

22:55 Guest Well, size-wise, satisfaction level is not what it could be. I mean, I'm like any other man, you know. Well, right now, probably about a little under three inches. But, you know, I'm whole, so I'm not complaining.

23:08 Adam Do you get to have erections?

23:10 Guest Yeah. Yeah.

23:12 Guest You can say the U word then, huh?

23:14 Adam Yeah, we can say everything but the S word and the F word. All right, so you get the erection. Does the penis function? Does things come out of it?

23:24 Guest Yes.

23:25 Adam Yeah.

23:26 Guest Really?

23:26 Adam Well, Drew's gonna need to see that demonstrated during the commercial break.

23:34 Guest That was one of the moments in the movie that was really a fulcrum because as Rene said, nobody had ever seen him naked when the doctor has to examine him because he looks so male. That was a very difficult time. At that point, Rene, we stopped the cameras and Rene said, do I have to do this? And I said, well, if we have to see the change, Rene was so willing to go someplace that he had never been before because nobody else had ever seen him naked. That was a big turning point in the movie and I think wanted, didn't want him to do it.

24:03 Adam Well, let's, oh yeah, and then we got to talk about your wife and then you actually getting a junk reassignment at halfway or 12, 14 years into a relationship. It's an onion that just has many, many, many layers to it. Dr. Bruce Hensel is here tonight and along with Rene. The Opposite Sex, Rene's story is on Showtime Documentary. Go to www.sho.com, find out times for airing. We'll get back into this subject, which Drew and I think find infinitely fascinating, even if all Drew does is non-grunt. Yes, Drew?

24:46 Drew Even that.

24:47 Adam It would have been better if you just went, hmm.

24:48 Drew I was thinking about that, but.

24:52 Adam All right, well, we'll never get that back. All right, we'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

24:56 Guest Hello, this is your radio.

25:20 Adam There, buddy, it's Loveline and Adam, that's Dr. Drew, David Alan Greer, or Dag, or possibly my main man, as we also know him. Coming in tomorrow night to lend his considerable hand to the radio show. That's great. Twinkie hole, baby, woo! Dag comes in once a year. I slide the chair back. I get in about four syllables an hour and let him carry the show, and then I get angry at Drew when we're done, because I realize that's what Drew does every night. Just non-breathe, buddy. But I feel like I haven't even done a radio show. Drew, when you're driving home, do you ever think, where was I? What was I doing? I must have some kind of nighttime gig. I wonder if I manage like a KFC or something. I'm gonna smell my cuticles. Maybe I'm in fast food. Oh, we get paid the same, too. Dr. Bruce Hensel here, everybody, from NBC all those years. One himself, a Emmy, yeah. He's a medical journalist. Also, he makes himself documentaries and the subject of his latest is a fella.

26:30 Guest Yeah, I got that, yeah, right.

26:32 Adam By the name of Rene, trying to, I'm scared to say and assign anyone a gender. Everyone, we're just us and we're all androgynous because I think I'm gonna screw it up. Rene is here. Rene was born with female genitalia, lived his life until what age, Rene?

26:56 Drew With, before the gender reassignment surgery?

26:59 Adam Yeah, what age?

27:00 Drew What age was the surgery?

27:01 Adam 31. So 31 and then had the gender reassignment surgery. All right, and so the surgery was an experimental variety. Overall, you give it a five. I mean, it's not exact science, right?

27:26 Guest Depends what your expectations are.

27:28 Drew Is there more to go?

27:29 Guest Well, Rene has had a couple of touch-ups already, right? And still more to go, right?

27:34 Drew Something comes out during orgasm.

27:37 Guest Mm-hmm.

27:37 Adam Wow. That's going to be my new, you know, when they go, they can put a man on the moon, but I can't make a toaster. This is my new man on the moon.

27:48 Guest It's not going to be semen and sperm. Because you're not going to make that unless you've got the apparatus to make that, right? And Rene's surgery, of course, required a hysterectomy. A hysterectomy as well, although he had been on testosterone for so long that his internal organs has pretty much shrunk.

28:05 Adam What about, what? First off, you know, the charge, chicks get a break on like car insurance. There's a handful of reasons why you wouldn't mind going down as a lady. You get to live longer, you get an insurance break. What do you got? Like your car insurance, paying the male rate or the female rate?

28:24 Guest I'm a male.

28:25 Adam So you're paying the male rate?

28:27 Guest Just, if that's what you pay, that's what I pay.

28:29 Guest I'm not sure what I pay.

28:30 Drew The female rate.

28:31 Adam I may even pay like the a-hole. Are you angry, Rene? No?

28:36 Guest For what?

28:37 Guest I don't know.

28:38 Adam You seem like you're PO'd or something.

28:40 Guest You're cool?

28:40 Guest No, yeah. I'm just trying to figure out where to come from.

28:44 Adam Well, I'm just saying like the whole, you always considered yourself a male, but I don't know what the government, for instance, would do. Like if you wanted to join the army, I don't know that they would just let you join the army. I don't think they would.

29:00 Guest Well, there's a lot of ignorance. I don't mean that.

29:05 Guest Just the facts.

29:06 Adam Right. They wouldn't let you do that.

29:09 Drew What is this country doing?

29:10 Guest In the facts, there's a lot of ignorance.

29:13 Drew But what would the fact be? Would they allow you to join or not because you're female? That's just the question we're asking.

29:18 Adam Right.

29:19 Guest Probably not. They don't tolerate you being gay, so why would they tolerate you being a transsexual?

29:23 Drew Well, they let you join the arm for gay.

29:26 Adam Well, I think...

29:27 Drew They let you join if you're female.

29:29 Adam They got the don't ask, don't tell thing. I was trying to get your break on your car insurance. Get off your knees! All right. Okay, so the gender reassignment went okay. Something comes out, but it's not semen. What is it?

29:44 Guest Well, it's natural fluid, bodily fluid.

29:46 Drew From like, Bartholomew's glands or something?

29:48 Guest Internally. I mean, women, you know, some women have orgasms with fluid. So it's just not that simple. You know, we're all born female. We are technically inside of our mother's female until we're three months of age inside the womb. And we all have, I don't know which words I can use here, but we all have female genitalia. Then if testosterone shows up in the bloodstream, that changes to male genitalia. If you don't have testosterone inside your mother, that never happens. So you can be X, Y and born with female genitalia. And then you don't find out until you're 13, you don't menstruate, they do a chromosome test, you find out you're X, Y, that's called a pseudo hermaphrodite. So it is, it's just chemical.

30:28 Drew Isn't that testicular feminization?

30:29 Guest No, that's a pseudo hermaphrodite. Testicular feminization is when you start out as a male, but you actually have the feminization. Right.

30:37 Adam So that's when your wife confiscates your nutsack, didn't that happen to you?

30:41 Drew That's, that's, yes.

30:43 Adam I have it about 12 years ago. When did you get married?

30:47 Drew 91.

30:48 Adam Honeymoon, 91.

30:49 Drew Testicular feminization.

30:50 Guest My point is that the apparatus starts out the same, so medically it's not as major as you think it is. To go from male to female, it's actually what they do is they invert the organs and they create the female out of it for female to male.

31:05 Adam What about long-term medical effects, for lack of a better term, but I mean, the, do people know how this affects you down the road?

31:19 Guest Well, we haven't had long-term studies, but we do know, for instance, there was another movie on called Southern Comfort where the arrogance of the doctors really failed the patient where even though it was a female to male transition, they did not take out the ovaries and the person ended up dying of ovarian cancer. But if you take testosterone-

31:37 Adam Hold on, that was called Southern Comfort?

31:39 Guest Yeah, the reason, I know it doesn't sound very comfortable.

31:41 Adam No, but there was a movie where the Army Reserve guys were hiking through the bayou with Keith Carradine in it called Southern Comfort.

31:51 Guest Yeah, well, Southern Comfort is also the name of a gender reassignment conference that occurs in the South. So that's where it got its name from.

31:59 Adam Oh, really?

31:59 Guest But that was the arrogance of the doctors. You know, any question about long-term effects? We don't know. We haven't studied them really well. But it's basically the long-term effects of Rene is on testosterone will be for life. So basically, he's more likely to have the longevity and the effects that a man would have and he considers himself a man and he's on testosterone.

32:18 Drew Except we don't know the effect of XX cellular function under the chronic influence of testosterone.

32:23 Guest We don't know that. We need better studies on that long-term.

32:26 Adam All right. I volunteer Drew. Lisa?

32:30 Drew Yes.

32:31 Adam You're 42? I am.

32:33 Drew Stesticular Feminization.

32:34 Adam Oh, that's right. You're 42? Yes. Your ex-husband was transgendered?

32:41 Caller He was in the process, yeah.

32:44 Adam Okay, so he was becoming a female?

32:47 Caller Yes.

32:48 Adam And after you got married?

32:52 Caller After our divorce.

32:53 Adam Oh, after your divorce. Is this the reason you got divorced?

32:56 Caller Excuse me?

32:57 Adam Is this the reason you got divorced?

32:59 Guest Oh, all right.

33:03 Adam Couldn't get his clothes into the hamper? Was it a bigger issue?

33:06 Caller He was a little bit of a cross-dresser during our marriage, but that wasn't any issue with us.

33:11 Drew What happened with your marriage?

33:13 Caller Cheating on me.

33:14 Drew Cheating with?

33:15 Caller Alcoholism.

33:16 Drew He was alcohol?

33:17 Caller Cheating with women.

33:18 Drew Cheating with women? Yeah. And he's attracted to women, got reassigned as a woman, and is he carrying on with women still?

33:28 Caller He actually committed suicide a couple months ago.

33:31 Drew Fantastic.

33:31 Guest Which is not unusual in the transgender population. There are a lot of suicides.

33:36 Caller That's what I understand.

33:37 Drew Particularly in the male to female.

33:40 Guest I don't know that it's really particularly in the male to female. The numbers in that are so hard to judge because so many female to males never come out. You never hear about them because they don't go through with the surgery. So it's hard to really study that.

33:51 Guest It's also easier to blend.

33:55 Adam Female to male is easier to blend.

33:56 Guest Yeah, because the testosterone is so strong.

33:59 Adam Right. And the other guys with the Adam's apple and the crazy.

34:03 Guest Well, you can shave the Adam's apple off now.

34:06 Adam I know, but some of them don't. The physicality, too. It seems like they're, I think you would just say, Rene, you'd say, well, I don't know how tall you are, but there's a guy who's not a big guy. But when you have the big female, it really draws your attention to it. I think it just works better.

34:29 Drew Liz, do you have any questions?

34:31 Caller Yeah, my question, of course, it's a moot point in our case anymore. He and I were still best friends, and we have a 14-year-old son. And so the relationship was really tight. But one of the things that he had said that I was always curious about, and yes, I still call him he, although I know her as well, was that the male to female, at least, he was concerned that there wouldn't be the actual orgasms, that there would be not the sexual gratification, and he had said that he would rather be a chick with a dick than not have orgasms anymore. And I'm curious what that kind of success rate is. It's something I've always wondered about.

35:10 Guest Well, from the male to females, it's hard to say again, because one of the problems with this is that it's so poorly studied. But of the male to females that I've spoken to, as well as Jamie, the subject of the other movie, many of them do report being able to have orgasm. But, you know, Drew may be able to answer this as well. I mean, it's hard to say, what is an orgasm? I mean, is it in a man, it's recognizable, it's visible, in a woman, it's not always visible.

35:37 Drew So what she's saying is he, as a male, wasn't willing to sacrifice his experience as a male to make the transition.

35:43 Adam And the chance that he wouldn't have one.

35:45 Drew Right.

35:45 Adam And the question is, maybe Lisa, did you not have orgasms? Yeah.

35:51 Caller Oh, yeah.

35:52 Adam You had them.

35:55 Drew How dare you, Adam? Just checking.

35:57 Caller Well, since I met him.

36:00 Adam How's that kid one, by the way?

36:02 Caller He's doing okay. It was interesting to hear what you were saying about male to female and how it's not as with the Adam's apple and everything. And he'd only seen a picture of his father as Aaron. And as a girl or as a boy? Looks like dad in a dress.

36:17 Adam Wait a minute. He had a name that works either way. Oh, it looks like, yeah.

36:21 Drew He'd only seen a picture of dad as a woman.

36:23 Caller Yeah, and said he looked like dad in a dress and yeah. But he was a little guy, so he could have pulled it off. He lived his...

36:31 Adam Well, to me, it would be like one of those six foot and under basketball leagues. Like if you were six, five and you came in for gender reassignment, I'd toss you out. This is never going to work. I don't need this going down in my record, by the way, is a failure. You come in as a petite, like, you know, my buddy, the Wheeze?

36:48 Drew Wheeze be a good woman.

36:50 Adam Oh, he does.

36:50 Drew Oh, Adam. What are you saying?

36:53 Adam You share food time with a man for a year in a one bedroom apartment. Things happen.

36:57 Drew I said a woman, not a bitch.

36:58 Adam That's all. I'm a passionate man. That's all. All right. We got to take. We got to take a break. Oh, that's a fair amount of transgender stuff going on tonight. Dr. Bruce Hensel is here tonight along with Rene. The Opposite Sex, Rene's story is the name of the documentary. Is it an hour long? How long is it?

37:22 Guest It's an hour and 15 minutes long, followed by a 20 minute panel with other transgenders.

37:28 Adam I don't know that there's ever been a, I'm not sure there's ever been a movie, really, like a theatrical release. Not a documentary, but anyone really made a serious attempt at one of these movies? I mean.

37:39 Guest Yeah, Boys Don't Cry is the Tina Brandon story. Oh, it is. Which is transgendered and she was murdered, of course. Actually Rene's hero, I believe. Am I right?

37:49 Guest Nobody's my hero except for Jesus.

37:53 Guest That's another side of it.

37:54 Adam Don't try to put words in Rene's mouth.

37:56 Guest But yeah, so it has been a theatrical release, but nobody has ever followed it from start or at least beginning somewhere in the middle to finish before through the person's eyes, which is what the opposite sex does.

38:06 Adam Is this a tape, by the way?

38:08 Guest Yes, it is.

38:09 Adam Oh, well, watch this when I get home.

38:11 Guest All right, we'll take a quick break.

38:13 Adam We'll be right back. I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. It's Adam.

38:23 Drew And I'm Dr. Drew.

38:24 Adam Here to talk about Axe Deodorant Body Spray.

38:27 Drew Yes, sir.

38:28 Adam You spray that on, you give stink the Axe. Hey, everybody.

38:42 Guest It's Loveline.

38:43 Adam I'm Adam, that's Dr. Drew, Dr. Bruce Hensel here tonight, along with Rene. Rene, subject of a documentary, Dr. Bruce Hensel produced, called The Opposite Sex, Rene Story. It's on Showtime. We go www.sho.com, and you find out all the listings. Let's talk to Eric down here on line four, who saw the documentary. Eric?

39:07 Guest Eric?

39:08 Yeah.

39:08 Adam You're 18? Yes. What's up? You saw the documentary?

39:12 Caller Yeah.

39:12 Adam Did you enjoy it?

39:13 Caller Oh, it touched me very much, how a man like that can just keep God in his life, dealt a very, not good hand, but he can still keep God in his life and religion, and still love the world.

39:29 Adam Did you have a question?

39:31 Caller Yeah, I just had a question of how you felt after the surgery. I know you walked around showing yourself and you were proud of it, but you really feel good now, or do you just feel so-so, like you don't feel complete?

39:46 Guest I know, I completely feel complete. It's just a totally different world. All the problems that I had prior to that movie are gone. I have new problems with dealing with penis size and things other men deal with normally every day, which really was never a problem before because I didn't have to directly deal with those things, whereas I have to directly deal with those things now, but hey, those are good things to deal with.

40:15 Drew What were the problems before the operation that have gone away?

40:18 Guest Just being whole, not dealing with a dildo and not a penis and those kinds of things.

40:24 Drew I mean, you don't have to just say, now dealing with things that other men deal with every day.

40:29 Adam I'm dealing with the dildo every night, every night, every night, except for the dildo gets paid the same as I do.

40:35 Guest Exactly the same.

40:38 Adam All right, so you would have an intercourse with your wife via some sort of strap-on apparatus or something in the past.

40:48 Guest Correct.

40:48 Adam And now you can have intercourse?

40:52 Guest Not quite intercourse yet. Can do everything else but except for.

40:57 Adam Ooh, is it getting close? It's been a couple of years since the surgery, did you say?

41:02 Guest It's been two years, yeah.

41:03 Adam Is that the goal, is intercourse a reasonable goal?

41:08 Guest That's a goal for me. For me, it definitely is. To actually feel what you've felt your entire life, what you've taken for granted your entire life. I wanna feel.

41:19 Adam Drew doesn't take it for granted, by the way. He's a passionate man.

41:22 Drew No, very much appreciated.

41:24 Adam Every day. Every day, yeah. Drops to his knees. When his wife drops to his knees, he appreciates it.

41:32 Guest Ray, one of your major goals was feeling whole, right?

41:36 Guest That's the only goal, is to feel body and soul.

41:39 Guest For you to have your outsides and insides.

41:41 Guest For me, yeah, for me. I can't speak for the entire transsexual community. I can just only speak for myself.

41:47 Adam Speaking of transsexual community, Cindy. You're 19?

41:53 Caller Yes, I am. My question is, my friend has sex with transsexuals and both women and he says he doesn't like men at all and he doesn't consider these transsexuals yet. They have penises.

42:11 Guest Are they transsexuals or transvestites?

42:14 Adam They're transvestites. That's a guy who just dresses as a woman, let's just say. Shut up. Then there, people, the reason I'm doing this, I'm putting it on hold because people get very confused about this. They call the wrong people transvestites and transsexual and it kind of comes interchangeable and all that kind of stuff. So stop me if I'm wrong. And we'll just do one gender here. So a guy who dresses like a woman that is transvestite. A guy who dresses a woman and takes the hormones can be a pre-op transsexual. That's what they would call them, a pre-op transsexual. And then after the operation, you're just a transsexual, right? Or you just are what you become.

43:04 Guest You know, I think transsexual just refers to somebody who is one sex and wants to be the other. It's that simple. Somebody who just dresses. There are many men who get off as dressing as a woman, and that's a sexual turn on for them, but they have no desire to be a woman. Those are transvestites. You want to change sexes, whatever transition point you're at, you're a transsexual.

43:27 Adam Fair enough. Cindy. All right. So now we're back, and your friend who's a male?

43:37 Drew Is with men who present as women.

43:43 Guest And women who present as men.

43:45 Adam I know, but listen, goofball, can you make us more confused? You're calling about the fact that he has relations with...

43:52 Drew People with penises.

43:53 Adam People with penises.

43:54 Drew Is that right? Exclusively.

43:57 Adam No, he does both.

43:59 Drew Well, I wanted both.

44:01 Adam The ladies and the...

44:02 Drew I thought you meant maybe both was female to male, transsexuals.

44:09 Adam Right. Is one of them you?

44:14 Caller No, no.

44:15 Adam Do you like the guy?

44:18 Drew No, I mean like-like.

44:19 Adam Yeah, what are you so invested in the guy for?

44:23 Caller Well, we've been friends ever since we were 14.

44:26 Adam Okay, and you're not attracted to him?

44:28 Caller No, no.

44:30 Adam All right.

44:31 Caller I kind of knew him as, I mean, I feel like he's denying his sexuality.

44:38 Adam Well...

44:38 Drew He doesn't seem to be.

44:40 Adam It seems like he'll take on all commerce. Yeah, he's saying he's heterosexual. He may be confused. Well, he has gay sex with these people. And yet he passes himself off as heterosexual.

44:57 Drew Was he sexually abused growing up? And maybe sexually too? Well, the kids that are physically abused are then good targets for sexual abuse. So I think you pretty much bank on that.

45:16 Adam Either way, the guy's compass is spinning around like he's in the Devil's Triangle. Here's the thing, Cindy, I don't think it's your job to really explain to him what his sexual proclivity is or put a label on him. If you want to be friends with him, just be friends with him. And I would probably try to stay out of that whole side of his life because it's going to get ugly.

45:37 Drew And if he's confused, get him some therapy so we can clarify things. All right?

45:42 Guest Remember, this is about sexuality, not about gender. It's not necessarily what he feels like it's what he's attracted to.

45:47 Drew Right, right, that's sexuality stuff. And that's what's spinning around for him.

45:50 Guest Well, and he may be bisexual. Maybe he don't have the problem with who he is. She has a problem with who he is.

45:55 Guest Yeah, maybe it just turns him on. I mean, whether that's right, wrong or ill or healthy, the point is it turns him on. That's not about gender.

46:04 Adam I think it's the denial part was the part that she was focusing on. But anyway, all right. I'm tossing our guests out of the studio, and we're going to do a second hour as a regular Loveline type hour. I want to thank Dr. Bruce Hensel for coming in here and Rene and tell everyone to go watch The Opposite Sex, Rene's story, on Showtime, and it just airs at different times, so you can find it by going to www.sho.com and watching this documentary. Thanks, guys.

46:39 Guest Thank you. It was a pleasure.

46:40 Guest Thank you.

46:41 Adam We'll be right back after this.

46:43 Guest Here it is.

46:44 Guest Bottom line, it sucks being single today.

46:46 Caller Tons of lame people and no decent prospects.

46:49 Guest Call the Dateline.

46:51 Guest 1-877-889-DATE.

46:57 Caller Love Line will be right back.

46:58 Guest So get your problems ready.

47:23 Adam Phone number 1-800-L-V-E-1-9-1, David Allen Grier, in here tomorrow night for a vastly different show.

47:28 Guest Who?

47:30 Adam Dr. Bruce Hensel and his subject, Rene, have left the building. We're gonna keep him for longer. I just had an asshole agenda reassignment. And I'm ready to move on.

47:44 Guest Yeah, it's too weird, it's too weird in here.

47:46 Adam I couldn't take it anymore. Okay. Devon?

47:50 Drew Yes?

47:51 I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

47:54 Drew You do.

47:54 Adam What?

47:54 Drew He's being challenged.

47:55 Adam He's a great guy.

47:58 Drew We're talking to Devon. What's up, dude?

47:59 Adam And by the way- Cruel guy. God, if he's gonna mix people up that way. If you're talking about the ultimate practical joke is having a male born inside a female's body or vice versa. I mean, as the maker, you know what I mean? That's way bigger than putting the cellophane over the toilet.

48:26 Drew Actually, if I wish that, now all of a sudden I wish my neighbor back is. I think I'm interesting his preoccupation with the penis. Like the penis was gonna make everything okay.

48:34 Adam Yeah, believe me, it doesn't. No, Devon.

48:37 Yeah.

48:38 Adam Sorry, baby doll. Go ahead. You're 21.

48:41 Caller Yes, I'm 21.

48:43 I'm from Kansas City and I just had a question about last night's show. Nicole Richie was talking about how she could sit on cold floors and have orgasms and have multiple orgasms and with intercourse, I can have orgasms easily with other things like oral sex or with a mic.

49:11 Adam That's the sound I make when I give oral.

49:13 Guest Having them easy is different than having multiple orgasms, slightly different issue.

49:18 Drew But what's the question? What is the question?

49:21 Oh, I already asked the question. I just wanted to know.

49:26 Adam All right, Drew, let's get some more transgendered callers on here. What was her thing?

49:34 Drew I didn't get the question.

49:37 Adam Nicole Richie had an orgasm and I didn't.

49:39 Drew No, she said she can. She says I can have them very easily.

49:42 Adam Yeah, but she gets to do it just sitting on the floor putting her mascara on and I got to get some oral.

49:47 Drew Yeah.

49:49 Adam Do you think she had a question?

49:50 Drew I don't know.

49:51 Adam She's got to be cute. Devin?

49:53 I have a question.

49:54 Adam All right, spit it out. Are you good looking?

49:57 Yes, very good looking. Yes.

49:59 Adam Very good looking, yes? Yes. That's sexy. I know because I can, you're a pain in the ass.

50:05 Okay, well I just wanted to ask you, is there any way that you could have orgasm with intercourse if you haven't had one before?

50:17 Drew Some people can, but most women can't.

50:19 Adam Yeah.

50:20 Drew And a woman that has it typically only with oral sex has great difficulty having with intercourse and many, if not most, never have it with intercourse. You don't cross over it.

50:30 Adam But if you're sort of, if the orgasms come easily, you have a better chance of doing it.

50:38 Drew But no, that is very different than what Nicole Richie was describing, which is someone who the moment intercourse begins starts having orgasms and continues to have them over and over and over again throughout intercourse, not one, not two or three, 40 or 50. Right. And then, but that person, the Nicole version, Nicole Richie version doesn't like oral sex. It's sort of like, eh, whatever.

51:03 Adam Imagine, what a package. Doesn't like the oral, so you dodge that bullet and then just makes you feel like King Kong every time you unzip your fly. And that's great. All right, Devin, you're fine and you can, you know, you can try a little self-stimulation during the intercourse, but it usually becomes a little overwhelming for the ladies.

51:26 Drew Yes.

51:27 Guest Yeah.

51:28 Drew No kidding, Adam.

51:29 Adam Guys don't really have a version of that, by the way, like licking, rubbing your nipple while you're on top of a chick or like, I'm going to caress my sack while I'm on you. Give us a little bunghole pleasure while I'm on the woman, like, do we need anything extra?

51:45 Guest That's the point.

51:45 Adam And by the way, slap in the face to a woman if we did that, the equivalent to what they do when we're on them.

51:52 Drew I need a little direct stimulation.

51:54 Adam Yeah. Yeah. This is good. I give it a seven. I'm just going to push myself up into the nines and tens here. Let me just lick my finger, rub those small circles around my nipple. That would freak me out. You're freaking me out. Yeah. A little, a little sac stroke, you know, just like I'm thinking. Yeah. You know, like a professor scratches his chin. Yeah.

52:19 Drew The Chinaman's beard.

52:20 Adam Yeah. All right.

52:21 Drew Oh my God.

52:23 Adam Let's see.

52:26 Drew Five.

52:27 Adam Five. Oh, okay. Let's talk to Brianna. Brianna.

52:31 Caller Hi, Brianna.

52:33 Adam You're 17. What's up? Do a lot of people call you, do a lot of people call you Brianna?

52:40 Drew Or Brianne?

52:41 Caller No, maybe a lot of Briannas.

52:43 Adam So but you're not Brianna, you're Brianna, right?

52:47 Yeah.

52:48 Drew Do you correct people when they say Brianna?

52:51 What?

52:51 Drew Do you correct people when they say Brianna? No. Okay. See, Adam likes you. He almost hung up on you, by the way.

52:59 Adam My finger was right on the dump button. That's good. You don't correct people. No. All right, Brianna. What's going on? Let's get a hand in. Break it down now. Let's go. Let's get it going now, Drew. Hey, gentlemen. Now, use that term loosely. Helmet, not a chair. Let's go, Brianna.

53:18 Before my boyfriend officially started going out, like, I gave him a head a lot.

53:22 Guest And I really like giving him a head, and it turns me on.

53:25 Caller But now, like, he sort of begs for it and asks for it, like, every day.

53:29 Adam Sure. How old is he?

53:31 He's 19.

53:33 Drew And now that he likes it, you don't like giving it anymore?

53:35 I like it. It's just that I wish he didn't ask for it so much.

53:37 Guest And I tell him, stop asking him. I told him to do things so I can't, you know, come on.

53:43 Drew Yeah, but hang on. But think, before he started asking for it, how often did you like to do it?

53:48 Guest Well, I met him two months before we officially started going out, and I get to him, I think, about 50 times.

53:55 Drew Wow. So, every day?

53:57 Guest Kind of, yeah.

53:58 Guest Every time.

53:58 Drew It was 10 days off, yeah, Sunday's off.

54:01 Guest 50 times. Okay, now, but here's the irony.

54:04 Adam Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. You met him two months before you started going out.

54:10 Guest Well, we were kind of dating, but it wasn't like an official thing. He was kind of getting over his ex-girlfriend.

54:14 Drew They were seeing each other, but they weren't girlfriend boyfriend.

54:17 Adam Yeah.

54:17 Drew She was doing the...

54:18 Adam Getting over the ex-girlfriend. Yeah, you may have tasted the little foreign lady on that Johnson, too, right?

54:28 Drew But more importantly...

54:29 Adam Hold on, hold on. Do the getting over math. Nineteen-year-old dude who gets copious amounts of oral sex. Yeah, I'm still working on getting over, emotionally getting over, dealing with the stress, coping, or still trying to patch it together and getting a little maintenance humping in. And by the way, yeah, no, we won't be having intercourse. You'll just be essentially squeegeeing her essence off my door via your mouth. Son of a bitch. All right, Brianna. I'm sorry about that unflattering portrait, but he was having sex with his ex while you were... Oh, what? No, no.

55:14 Drew Oh, yeah. But be as amazed. She was sort of...

55:17 Adam Well, who dumped him? It took him a while.

55:20 Drew But again, this is the new broom sweeping clean. And it should be a version of that for this kind of a situation. All right.

55:28 Adam Well, the point is, is you can tell him that this is not every day.

55:35 Guest Well, I do. He just sort of, you know, like tugs the hair, pushes the head down a little bit.

55:42 Drew Uh-oh.

55:43 Adam Is this a...

55:43 Drew I don't like that.

55:44 Adam What about his ex-girlfriend? Did she dump him?

55:48 Guest Yeah.

55:49 Adam And they've gone out for a while and then she dumped him?

55:53 Guest Um, I don't know for how long. I think it was just like over the summer.

56:02 Drew But notice how... When he's still with someone else and he's not really available, Brianna's in.

56:08 Adam Well, sure, because she's selling at that point.

56:10 Drew And as soon as she lands him and now he wants to have a relationship and is interested in her on a daily basis, she's not interested.

56:18 Adam Well, that's the interview part of the job. Now she's on the job. And she's still working at the post office. This is what you get. All right. So listen, Brianna, you tell him you'd have a much greater likelihood of getting a little BJ action if you didn't do the hair tugging and the kinds of haranguing. All right?

56:39 Drew I'm not sure it's going to make any difference. She's just looking for it. Although that's certainly an unpleasant thing for him to do to her. She's just, she's only interested in the cannot haves.

56:50 Adam Yeah. Yeah. And this guy basically, his story is he got dumped by a chick he was hot for. Mm-hmm. And was...

57:00 Drew You're right. He must have been still seeing her. He was dancing. Otherwise, Brianna would not have been into it. Think about it. Dumped by another chick? She would have not been in.

57:07 Adam He got dumped on. He was... Yeah. He got dumped on. He was trying to patch it up. He was trying to work on it, trying to scrape back into the relationship. Meanwhile, he was on a little maintenance, a little methadone maintenance with Brianna. Over here, a little methadone. And methadone maintenance. And then at a certain point, it became obvious that the thing was not going to work out and not be salvaged. Probably his ex probably started going out with somebody else. And then he just agreed to give it a go with Brianna. All right, let's talk to Jane, who's 22, Jane. What's up?

57:45 Guest I'm, I just started, I'm on my second month of NuvaRing. And I'm wondering, well, what I was told was that the NuvaRing had less hormones, so it was directly in your vagina. So I'm wondering, well, doesn't that decrease the chances of decreasing your sex drive?

58:02 Drew Yeah, that's right. Because it doesn't have so many systemic effects. That's correct.

58:06 Adam How do they get that in there?

58:09 Guest You make it skinny and just stick it up there and leave it in there. Yeah, taco.

58:18 Adam You fold it over in half, right?

58:19 Drew You make the circle into an eclipse kind of.

58:22 Guest Kind of like that in Fed Cup, but without the cup.

58:25 Adam Like what without the cup?

58:27 Guest There's like a...

58:28 Drew Diaphragm. Oh. Like the ring of a diamond.

58:33 Adam All right, so you fold it out.

58:34 Drew Yeah, like a cup, but not a cup.

58:36 Adam What'd you say? Like a cup, but not a cup?

58:39 Guest Oh, there's a... Like a... In Fed Cup, that's rubber and it has stuff for your period.

58:47 Adam Oh, really?

58:49 Guest I didn't like it.

58:51 Adam It has stuff for your period? You mean like in Louvre using a tampon?

58:56 Guest Yeah.

58:58 Adam Oh, I mean, hold on a second. So it's like a rain barrel as opposed to a sponge.

59:05 Guest Right. Yeah, kind of.

59:07 Adam That... From what I remember.

59:09 Guest No, it was actually more of a half of a condom with a little thing, with a little rubber thing. That's what it reminded me of.

59:17 Adam So anyway, you got the Nuva ring up there.

59:22 Guest And the three weeks that I have it in, I don't really... It seems to me like sex, I just don't care about it. And then the week that I have it out, I'm just... I'm back to my normal self, where I attack my boyfriend.

59:34 Drew There you go.

59:36 Guest So I'm wondering...

59:37 Drew You gotta talk to the doctor about it. It may not be the right hormones for you.

59:41 Adam Do they adjust the hormones in those Nuva rings?

59:45 Drew Yeah, no, it's hard to do that.

59:47 Adam So it's not like the pill.

59:48 Drew Yeah, it's not all these different varieties.

59:50 Adam The Nuva ring is just a Nuva ring.

59:52 Drew I'll look at other, maybe a couple of doses, but it's much less choices.

59:56 Adam And pardon the pun, but it's impregnated with hormones? The rubber and the like releases. Holy Christ. What is going on out there, Drew?

1:00:07 Drew Good times.

1:00:08 Adam Yeah. I got to get something.

1:00:11 Drew What do you mean?

1:00:12 Adam Just, you know, as a guy, on one hand, it's like, well, good, good rinse. We don't have to deal with any of this stuff. On the other hand, you know, women have about 700 million more products than we have. Like we got aftershave and toilet paper. I don't even know what we get as a guy, you know, what do we get product wise?

1:00:33 Drew I mean, we get it all happens later. Yeah, but we neurologists and I'm just I'm talking catheters.

1:00:41 Adam No, Drew, listen to me. Product wise.

1:00:44 Drew I know. We get believe it. They're products. You've seen them on the show.

1:00:47 Adam Look, I'm not talking about national brands, you know, just talking about products, you know, I'm not I'm not that you would do could would purchase it at a store, not not stuff you get a medical supply house.

1:00:58 Guest I'm just just junk.

1:01:00 Adam You know, I mean, women have 450 things that go in the coups alone. Yeah, we got nothing. We got a condom.

1:01:06 Drew How about things that just goes on hair or goes on eyelids?

1:01:10 Adam Oh, eyelids.

1:01:11 Drew Think about it.

1:01:11 Adam I didn't even know I had eyelids.

1:01:13 Drew You don't.

1:01:13 Adam Yeah, guys. And we got nothing that goes. Here's what we got for the eyes. We got sunglasses. And I got one of them big lovey shade things, a furry shade things I like to nap on the plane with. But that's it. And and yeah, OK, listen, if you're gay enough, you can use some of the exfoliating scrub or whatever. But and I guess, you know, you know, where we beat the chicks out on the acid reflux stuff. We get to eat more of that stuff. But nothing to say they can't do it either.

1:01:40 Drew Not just for them.

1:01:41 Adam Yeah, I know. But then they would say, well, you could put the ice stuff on. But no, that's for you.

1:01:46 Drew And do we have anything that's used speculairly, uniquely for male?

1:01:53 Adam Yeah, a C-Ring.

1:01:55 Drew C-Rings, yeah, you're right.

1:01:56 Adam You do the C-Math, by the way.

1:01:58 Drew You're right. But there aren't that many product variations around the C-Ring.

1:02:01 Adam So here's the thing, too. Like you sit around and watch TV, it's just everything, you know. Especially if you're looking at any chick-oriented whatever. It's all the commercials. You get nothing. We're left out. Ironically, who pays for it, Drew? That's right. Me and you. Me and you, my brother.

1:02:18 Drew That's because you have all that, the mail has such an advantage in the salary department.

1:02:23 Adam That's right. That's right. That's the only reason everything handed to us.

1:02:34 Guest Oh my.

1:02:38 Drew Novelty, sleepy.

1:02:39 Adam B.J.'s been on hold for 94 minutes.

1:02:49 Guest Wow.

1:02:51 Adam We just struck gold. That is, that's what you call gold.

1:02:58 Drew Luke, I am your son. I am your father.

1:03:12 Adam If you wake him up, I'll kill you. Now here's a few, a couple of things. First off, BJ swears up and down to his buddies he doesn't snore when they're mad at him.

1:03:24 Drew He's mad at them, but they bring it up.

1:03:25 Adam Yeah, I like that too. I like that one. I really enjoy that one where you go camping with one of your buddies, you guys end up in the same hotel room, whatever the situation is. And the guy wakes up the next day and he's like, dude, you were sawing logs all last night. Hey, I don't snore. Yeah, I just, that's what I do. I make it up. I do that sometimes. I'll do it with my wife right in the middle of the night. She's, I don't even know if she's breathing. I knock her, quit it. I yell at her and give her earful the next morning. Yeah, like that's what you do.

1:03:55 Drew It's a comical, funny, everyone does that, right?

1:03:58 Adam That's one of those, and that's all you need to know about how horrible humans are. When somebody says, hey, you were snoring, I know I wasn't, really? What was I hearing? What's in it for me? That's what we have to ask ourselves. What's the motivation? So you made, no audible sound came out of your mouth. I just falsely accused you of it. And perhaps if you really were snoring, I would have let you slide. Is that the thing or would I say something for that?

1:04:26 Drew Oh, dude, the motivation is you're trying to humiliate me, man.

1:04:28 Adam Yeah, I know better. I know better.

1:04:31 Drew By the way, if you're trying to humiliate, you're just fine at that without the snoring.

1:04:43 Caller I got the sound turned way down, too.

1:04:47 Adam And here's the thing, too. First off, I'm amazed that some people make it through the night every night.

1:04:52 Drew Alive.

1:04:53 Adam It's like, if your lung would collapse at some point, or they would just, they actually seem like it's such work to breathe for them that eventually their heart's just gonna stop.

1:05:02 Drew There is sleep apnea, and that BJ, I think, may well have it.

1:05:05 Guest Read BJ's Poor Bastard's Probe.

1:05:08 Adam Premature ejaculation, only had sex with one girl.

1:05:12 Drew 21.

1:05:13 Adam Happened all the time. Now, we've heard, and by the way, we've heard a lot of violence snoring in our day on the show. I look at it as the ultimate compliment as a talk show host at when we can go ahead and punch up line five, and three quarters of people are so unlawful. BJ has been waiting around for over an hour and a half, but this snoring that he does is really is really-

1:05:41 Drew Medical.

1:05:42 Adam Yeah, it's really, it's from the cockpit. It sounds like some of those early Apollo missions where they would talk to a shepherd or whoever the hell was circling the world's, the globe, BJ. Well, that's it for the show, Drew. This is the rest of the night. I-

1:06:15 Drew And here's what's even scarier. Let it be for a second. I think we can do much better.

1:06:21 Adam Oh, BJ? Yeah, oh no, this is him. He's sitting up. He hasn't hit rim yet.

1:06:25 Drew Yeah, yeah, this is at his best. If he, head goes back on his back.

1:06:29 Adam Oh yeah.

1:06:30 Guest Yeah, yeah.

1:06:31 Drew BJ is not a small boy.

1:06:37 Adam Guys with initial names are usually, they go about 80 pounds more than your average guy. That's number one. And then guys who-

1:06:44 Drew Obstruct when they breathe.

1:06:46 Adam Yeah, but I'm picturing the curtains moving in the room.

1:06:49 Drew It's like Franklin's time.

1:06:51 Adam Oh, he almost died.

1:06:57 Drew It's a phrase behind a Barbera cartoon.

1:06:59 Adam I'm amazed at the guys who snore too on how much variation there is in even like a 30 second period. That, it's an all night. I mean, you're sawing away all night. You'd think you'd pretty much just put together a kind of a Three Stooges novelty snore and that would be, that would be it. But they're all over the map. Like you'll just see them like, they'll do an inhale and an exhale. They'll put together about five and then the sixth one's like, all of a sudden there's a huge deviation.

1:07:29 Drew That's why the sleep is so disturbed. Cause it causes arousals all night long. And having to work against it. It's actually puts tremendous pressure on their heart, so when Fred inhales and the curtains come in, the curtains go out.

1:07:45 Guest Right.

1:07:49 Adam We have been at what we call nocturnal emission.

1:08:02 Guest I really do have his potentiometer like half at a half mast right now.

1:08:05 Drew Well, tell me what that means.

1:08:06 Guest It's basically turning his mic.

1:08:07 Guest Yeah, it's down to like from 10 to five.

1:08:09 Drew We're at 10, and he's half our volume. And yet shaking the earth.

1:08:16 Adam Geez, I hope he lives alone.

1:08:19 Guest All right, all right, let's take a call.

1:08:23 Drew I wonder if anything has anything to do with his premature ejaculation. Why? I don't know, if any of that physiology of his sleep and body habitus and stuff. Interesting.

1:08:33 Guest Well, it may.

1:08:35 Adam I have no idea. We're supposed to take a break. We will do that. Michael's 24, male exotic dancer. Sex is great, but can't get a girlfriend. Really? Male exotic dancer, can't get a girlfriend? Something's up with that. We gotta take a break, but hold on. Michael?

1:08:53 Drew You're gay.

1:08:55 Caller Yeah, whatever. No, I get-

1:08:58 Drew Now you know why?

1:08:59 Adam What? Yeah, horrible attitude.

1:09:02 Caller Horrible attitude.

1:09:03 Drew You're gay.

1:09:04 Caller I'm gay. Please.

1:09:05 Adam All right, so you can't get a girlfriend.

1:09:09 Caller I've got plenty of women's lady friends, but no one that wants to actually date me seriously.

1:09:15 Guest Shocking. And why do you think that is?

1:09:18 Adam Because of your profession?

1:09:20 Caller I'm thinking. I don't know if I should change my name and leave the state, you know, because, well, specifically the last girl I've tried to date seriously, seemed I had danced for one of her co-workers' bachelor parties, and as soon as she saw me with my friend...

1:09:44 Adam She ratted you out?

1:09:45 Caller Yeah.

1:09:46 Drew I pretty much bet that it won't make any difference if people know his job or not.

1:09:50 Adam What's that?

1:09:51 Drew I pretty much could bet that it wouldn't make any difference if people knew his career or not.

1:09:55 Adam If she was really into him?

1:09:56 Drew No, that he would have trouble finding a girlfriend, whether or not the word was out about his career.

1:10:02 Adam Oh, I see. Well, that's a slap in the face. Well, hold on, Michael. I'd like to help out young Michael. First, we've got to see how BJ's doing. I'm scared to go to break because we've got lighting in a bottle there and BJ may just die on us or worse, wake up. Well, we'll get back and I would, Anderson, I would then like to put BJ under Michael's call because I don't want to go away from, you know what I mean?

1:10:37 Drew You've got to monitor.

1:10:38 Adam They've got the baby monitors.

1:10:39 Drew Of course, it's that.

1:10:40 Caller I don't know if Michael would like that though. He might be upset with that.

1:10:45 Adam Oh, that's going to be a river we're going to have to cross after this. That's Dr. Drew. I just go ahead and eat those. Drew got himself some Mambanins. The thing came out, the machine did that thing where, yeah, Drew put his 50 cents in, the thing came to the very edge and then just stopped. And Drew then viciously attacked the machine, like the ape on the Samsonite commercial. He went after that. I've never seen such upper body strength. And you, Drew did a move. It was a clean and jerk move. He put his right, well, first he threw a quick form shiver to the machine to loosen it up. Then he threw his right foot back, put both his palms on the top edge of the machine and pressed it so that it actually tilted back at about 45 degrees. And it was really, you know, the equivalent, you know, they say, actually they never say it anymore, but they used to say, you know, when a mother sees her child trapped under a station wagon, she can, she's capable of states of amazing strength, superhuman strength, you know, lift the whole station wagon. Drew has that when somebody has 50 cents worth of his M&Ms and aren't giving it to them.

1:12:13 Drew It's like being on PCP, really.

1:12:15 Adam Yeah, yeah, you're like Rodney King.

1:12:17 Drew Yeah, if I'd kept escalating, I would have been lifting the thing up with my forearm pretty soon.

1:12:21 Adam Yeah, cops.

1:12:22 Drew Curling.

1:12:22 Adam Cops could have been shooting you with bean bags and tasers that would have stopped it. That's what you call priorities. So ladies and gentlemen, it's BJ. Oh, BJ. No, that's Anderson just potting him down because Anderson had it up.

1:12:42 Guest Oh, I could use saying his name.

1:12:46 Drew That was that was Sleep Apnea. That was him. I can hear some big ones.

1:12:51 Guest Really?

1:12:52 Adam We got a big set rolling. Oh, my God.

1:12:59 Guest This guy, we got to be.

1:13:07 Drew A little brass, little ones, and then watch my headphones.

1:13:12 Guest Little, little.

1:13:15 Drew Here comes.

1:13:16 Adam No, I think he died.

1:13:19 Drew That's coming outside.

1:13:22 Guest Oh, really?

1:13:22 Guest Really?

1:13:28 Adam Oh, he's back, he's back to his rhythm.

1:13:40 Drew It's gotta be followed up by some big ones. There we go.

1:13:43 Adam Oh, there we go.

1:13:47 Drew All right. We're due for some, we're due for some shadowing.

1:13:52 Adam Well, that's why I'm scared to go away from it. That's why Anderson, you gotta punch up Michael over here, the male exotic dancer, and keep BJ potted up as well, because I'm scared something may happen to this kid. There we go.

1:14:08 Caller There's just plenty of women to date, just none that I want to. The ones I do get screwed up real bad.

1:14:14 Drew What do you mean get screwed up?

1:14:17 Caller Well, like I was telling you earlier, with the one girl and her friend, getting caught through that, it just really, really irritating. And I'm...

1:14:29 Adam Well, how many dates did you have with the girl?

1:14:33 Caller Oh, well, we've... Let's see here. We went out several times. Then it got to the point where I... After she found out what I did, she got real interested in it for a while. We talked about it almost nonstop for like two weeks.

1:14:50 Drew How about your job?

1:14:51 Caller Suddenly we were too good of friends to date.

1:15:01 Adam Yeah, BJ just weighed in on that one. Speaking of weighing in, when you figure BJ goes about three bells, four bells.

1:15:08 Drew It's like a 350.

1:15:11 Adam All right, Michael. Yeah.

1:15:16 Drew I really don't think it's the work.

1:15:17 Adam I really don't. I don't either.

1:15:21 Drew He's gonna blame it, it's part of the problem.

1:15:23 Adam Do you work at a club, or do you just do like bachelor at parties?

1:15:26 Caller I have more money if I do private parties.

1:15:30 Drew Let's put it this way. Do you find that all your peers that do this dancing cannot have girlfriends?

1:15:36 Caller The women they date generally are not the women that I want to date.

1:15:40 Drew But they have girlfriends.

1:15:41 Adam Interesting. And how much do you make at a bachelorette party average?

1:15:46 Caller Oh, out here, it's not too well. When I was out in the East Coast, I was doing five, $600 a night, but I'm back in New Mexico where I was born and raised and now I'm lucky to top two.

1:16:01 Adam Although you can get a nice apartment in New Mexico for 400 bucks a month, right?

1:16:09 Caller I'm moving as soon as I can.

1:16:10 Adam Why?

1:16:11 Drew What are you doing back there?

1:16:12 Adam It needs some money.

1:16:13 Guest Well, let me ask you this.

1:16:15 Adam Do you ever have sex with any of the women in the bachelorette party?

1:16:19 Do you have a wife?

1:16:21 Caller No, because I kind of stick to, I've got a few really good friends with the benefits going on. That's all I stick to. There's just too much stuff out there to take the chance.

1:16:37 Adam Anderson, hang up on Michael, please.

1:16:42 Drew Thank you, BJ.

1:16:44 Adam Okay, so here's the thing. Something's a little up with Michael. Which is what I was thinking about. It's not the profession. And let me say this, by the way, ladies and gentlemen, all this stuff you attribute reasons as to why you're not getting some or getting too much or whatever, it's all just dust in the wind. If chicks are into you, they're into you. Oh, it's not the car you drive, it's not you giving them cocaine, it's not the money in your pockets, all that stuff. Sure, it helps, it helps if you pull up in something nice instead of a piece of ass, but either they're into you or they're not, and they really don't care so much what you do, and especially stripper, they go for that.

1:17:31 Drew They would anyway.

1:17:37 Adam All right, let's talk to Summer Anderson, and again, we have to keep BJ on line one, who's been on hold for now 106 minutes. Summer? Yeah, BJ is doing a little snoring for those of you who just tuned in.

1:17:53 Drew Summer?

1:17:54 Adam What's happening, baby doll? You're 25.

1:17:57 Caller I'm 25, and me and my husband went to a social event this weekend.

1:18:04 Adam Social event.

1:18:05 Caller Yeah, I won't tell you what, but we lost each other there.

1:18:11 Adam Wait a minute, was it some kind of swinger's party?

1:18:15 Caller No, it was a concert.

1:18:18 Adam Oh, you got a weenie roast?

1:18:22 Caller I can't tell you that.

1:18:24 Adam Why? All right, hang up on Summer, please, Anderson. Hang up, hang up, it's too late. Hang up on her. Thank you. See ya. And listen, everybody, there are things you don't want to tell us, that's fine, but if we ask and you don't tell us, hang up on you. That's it, there's policy. Let's talk to Lauren, who's 24. She's would be on line three there, Anderson.

1:18:51 Drew I'm gonna take this one, it's been an hour and a half, two hours for them, no, too late.

1:18:55 Adam Lauren?

1:18:56 Caller Hello?

1:18:56 Adam You're 24?

1:18:58 Caller Yes.

1:18:59 Adam What's happening?

1:19:02 I got a question actually about my boyfriend. We met through one of my ex-boyfriends, they've been friends since they were like five, and we dated for about two weeks, and we made plans to hang out this past Friday night. Well, he didn't end up calling me, and until about 11 or midnight, I ended up calling him, really loud with me on the phone, started swearing at me, calling me all kinds of names. Wow. He told me that it was over, he wanted nothing to do with me, but yet earlier in the day when we were talking, he told me how much he loved me and how much he wanted to stay with me. So we broke up, we went the whole weekend without speaking. I get to work on Monday, and he was sending me all kinds of messages about, I love you, I miss you, I'm sorry. He wants to go back out with me, and I'm just, I'm confused. I don't know what to do.

1:19:55 Drew Was he on drugs or drinking or something?

1:19:58 No, like Friday when we were supposed to hang out, he had to go see his probation officer for something that happened two years ago. That was alcohol related. And when I called him, he was at the bar. And he told me pretty much, if you don't trust me, don't call me ever again.

1:20:17 Adam What are you getting into trouble with the law for?

1:20:20 He got into trouble, it was two years ago, he got a DUI.

1:20:25 Adam I see.

1:20:25 Drew So he's an alcohol.

1:20:26 Adam So now, Hold on a second, you don't get a probation officer because you get a DUI.

1:20:30 It was a minor offense, it wasn't anything major.

1:20:34 Drew Yeah, why did he get a probation officer then?

1:20:36 I don't know, see, that's something I don't know.

1:20:38 Adam Well, wait a second, when did he get the DUI?

1:20:42 Two years ago.

1:20:43 Adam Two years ago. Yeah, you get a probation officer when you go in the joint, not when you get a DUI.

1:20:51 Well, he did tell me that he spent six months in jail because of the DUI.

1:20:56 Drew Okay, that means it was his third DUI.

1:20:57 See, I don't know.

1:20:59 Drew Yeah, you don't know how many he's had. The point is he's an alcoholic. Or he had other more serious offenses.

1:21:06 Adam That's a best case scenario.

1:21:07 Drew Yeah, right.

1:21:07 Adam Three DUIs is a best case scenario for this idiot.

1:21:12 Well, he's not an alcoholic because we'd hang out all the time and he doesn't like to drink that much.

1:21:16 Guest Where's my bourbon?

1:21:17 Adam I know, but you know what's great is really, and only Loveline callers are capable of this kind of denial, which is, yeah, I called him, he was at the bar. Yeah, he was yelling at me. He was yelling at me, he got in a little trouble because he was talking to his probation officer over a DUI fence he had earlier.

1:21:39 Drew How dare you ask him to go to the bar?

1:21:40 Adam But no, he's not an alcoholic. He doesn't like alcohol. Really?

1:21:43 Well, he's not, to me, an alcoholic is someone that drinks every day and they're dependent on it.

1:21:50 Drew Nope, that's the end stages of alcoholism, Laura.

1:21:55 Adam Yeah, look, he was at a bar talking to his probation officer about his last DUI.

1:22:01 No, he went to the bar after he talked to his probation officer.

1:22:05 Adam I'm sorry, listen, when you're wrong, you're wrong. I owe you an apology. I see, talk, talk to his PO and then went to the bar.

1:22:16 I'm just trying to figure out, like, if he wants to get back with me, and I'm just trying to figure out if that's the idea.

1:22:21 Adam How old is he? How old is he?

1:22:22 He's 22.

1:22:23 Adam Okay, do you have any kids?

1:22:25 I have a two-year-old son from my ex. All right.

1:22:31 Drew Was your ex an alcoholic too?

1:22:33 My ex, he's not an alcoholic, but he's quite violent.

1:22:37 Drew Was he a drug addict?

1:22:39 He's not a drug addict. He used to do a lot of drugs when he was younger, but now he's clean.

1:22:44 Drew All right, listen, Lauren.

1:22:45 Adam Lauren, here, okay, let me, Drew, I know you got stuff to say, but I got better stuff to say.

1:22:50 Drew You a Mormon?

1:22:50 Adam Here's a deal.

1:22:52 No, I'm not Mormon.

1:22:54 Adam Here's a deal.

1:22:55 Drew I don't expect PJ to answer too.

1:22:57 Adam I know.

1:22:57 Drew No, I'm not.

1:22:59 Adam Two snorts for no, one for yes. Lauren, you got a kid, you got a little bit of a wide ass and you think your number's been lowered and you got to settle for 22 year old guy's parolees who verbally abuse you when they're in a blackout state.

1:23:16 Drew Right.

1:23:16 Adam Okay?

1:23:20 Drew Just stop making excuses.

1:23:21 Adam I know your dad was a world-class jackass.

1:23:23 Drew And an alcoholic himself.

1:23:24 Adam And that's all you know. But for Christ's sake, on behalf of your kid, huh, how about you just break up with this guy, you go on your own for a little while, you focus on your relationship with your child, you focus on your work, and your spirituality and your friendships, and then when a decent guy comes along, you have a boring relationship with him and not eff your kid up any more than you already have. All right? All right, hang up on her. It's great, it's great. And listen, you dads out there, you alcoholic dads who are physically abused, or maybe emotionally abused, or just neglected, or sexually abused, you just put a shotgun in your mouth, you pussies. You pussies. This is what you get. You end up, your daughter, then she goes up hooking up with felons and making apologies for them, you know, and excuses for the rest of her life. That's it. And effing up whatever kid she has. She's got a 20, she's got a two-year-old kid with another dude who was a mean guy, shocking. Shocking, and by the way.

1:24:31 Drew Who used to be a drug addict, yeah.

1:24:33 Adam Yeah, how do you, listen, what do you think, by the way, as a society, how many of these people can we support? I mean, we're talking about this kid. You know what I mean? We need a certain amount of scientists and doctors. We need a certain amount of people that are employable. We need people to pay taxes. We need people to build roads. We need people to drive buses. All you effed up people with your effed up offspring, we can't handle it. The prison is already full, remember?

1:25:01 Drew Ask BJ for an opinion.

1:25:06 Adam That's right. See, when you're right, you're right. All right, we gotta take a break.

1:25:12 Drew He agrees with that too.

1:25:13 Adam BJ's 21. He's been on hold for now 106 minutes.

1:25:18 Drew I've been on hold all that time. He's been entertaining us for much longer.

1:25:22 Adam All right, he's been on the air for about 40 minutes. He has narcolepsy problem.

1:25:27 Drew That's sleep apnea.

1:25:28 Adam Sleep apnea. That is snoring you're hearing everybody.

1:25:31 Guest Yeah, that's the way in.

1:25:34 Drew We're concerned that we may expire if we don't keep it monitored here.

1:25:37 Adam Yeah, we'll take ourselves a break. Drew, he's calling from Nevada. Maybe she'd head out there with a crash cart. He's got a flat line any second now. All right, we'll take a quick break. They'll be right back.

1:25:58 Loveline. We'll be right back.

1:26:03 Guest Hey, everybody, it's Loveline.

1:26:05 Adam I'm Adam, that's Dr. Drew, David Alan Greer, Dag, also known as my main man, will be in here tomorrow night.

1:26:14 Guest Ooh.

1:26:18 Adam There's BJ. BJ's 21. BJ is a world-class snore and we'll just, I'm so intrigued with his violent snoring, his novelty snoring, that I've vowed to leave him on, not only for tonight, Drew, but until he wakes up. Yeah, yeah, all right, let's talk to John on line five, who weighs 408 pounds, Sean?

1:26:56 How you doing, Adam, Dr. Drew?

1:26:58 Adam How are you doing, John?

1:26:59 I'm doing pretty good, you know.

1:27:01 Adam Do you snore yourself, John?

1:27:03 Actually, I do have a mild sleep apnea. Actually, I'm having gastric bypass, the ruined wine.

1:27:18 Adam And now, you're 408 pounds, how tall are you? Six-two. Six-two. And you're 19, which is relatively young for the gastric bypass surgery.

1:27:31 Drew They're doing so much of this now. These bariatric procedures are just so common.

1:27:36 Adam You know, let's just talk about this for a second because, and Drew, tell me if you disagree, but here's what it's starting to look like. If you're, Anderson, pod BJ down for just one second. I gotta quit.

1:27:50 Drew Not too far down now.

1:27:50 Adam Not too far. No, we'll pod him back up for a second, but John's got a serious call and deserves a good answer. I think we're starting to realize that if you make it up over 400 pounds by 19, you got a genetic problem here.

1:28:04 Drew Oh, yes.

1:28:05 Adam And people, people love to do that day, you slob or you're eating too much or have some self respect or pull it together. But look, everybody, every 19 year old dude eats like, like he's going to the chair the next day. I mean, they're slobs, you know what I mean? I mean, I, I knew guys just, they'd be driving through all night takeout places, you know, before in the morning, they'd get a big, big milkshakes and stuff like that. Guys eat like pigs when they're 19. And the fat ones are just fat because their body metabolizes it or doesn't metabolize it in a certain way. And the super skinny ones, well, why are they super skinny? We all knew the guy pounding away three cheeseburgers and never exercised, never seen him put on a pound. I mean, that's just all metabolism. So I think what they're trying to start, starting to figure out now is John's 19, he's 400 pounds instead of torturing the guy and having yo-yo for another 15 years and blowing his heart and his knees out, let's just give him the surgery now.

1:29:01 Drew Oh, absolutely.

1:29:01 Actually, I just came back from college and I lost about 20, I went down like 380.

1:29:07 Adam Right, but you're probably not going to see 300 just using discipline and willpower. You know what I mean?

1:29:18 Yeah.

1:29:18 Adam So just get the surgery.

1:29:20 Drew The idea is that you have to sort of compensate for the genetic problem by changing the way your gastrointestinal system operates.

1:29:27 Well, actually, that's the rule by, you know, by having the rule of why you can't have, you know, I won't be able to have any sugar, only, you know, splendor, can't drink anymore. So I think that's a big, you know, push for me in the future. But my question was is that, you know, I, you know, I smoke a little herb. That's one of those, you know, after my surgery a few months after my surgery, I'll be still able to smoke the weed.

1:29:49 Drew Wow, I think that's how addictive pod is.

1:29:51 Well, in a way.

1:29:52 Guest It likes the weed.

1:29:53 Drew That's what I'm saying. Even though it's killing him and killing him, his wife's 400 pounds. So maybe the issue.

1:30:00 Guest What?

1:30:01 What?

1:30:01 Adam Oh, you get John. John, you get stoned and you eat.

1:30:05 Caller No, actually, you know what? I don't eat. I just chill. Just watch my movies and just play down.

1:30:10 Guest Yeah. Let me explain.

1:30:11 Adam Let me explain something. John, are you your brother, man?

1:30:14 Caller Yeah.

1:30:15 Adam OK. Black guy don't have the munchy gene. That's a white guy thing. I we're over at Snoop Dogg's house. That's my main mayonnaise. Stone with the guy. Jimmy raped the refrigerator and then ate the entire basket of muffins. He got Snoop Dogg. Oh, he got. Not interested in food. And it really made me realize brothers get stone and play Xbox. Why do you get stone and eats?

1:30:41 Caller I'm a veterinarian.

1:30:42 Adam We got I mean, I mean, I'm serious. Someone's got to look into this. Snoop Dogg doesn't get the munchies. Do you see what I'm saying? John, ironically, 408 pounds gets stone. It doesn't get the munchies.

1:30:56 Drew But you may want to look into it with the surge and the fact that you have marijuana addiction because you could develop full bone withdrawal. It could really be kind of a mess here in the post-operative period. It could significantly affect your post-operative course.

1:31:07 Adam Really?

1:31:08 Drew Marijuana withdrawal can be horrible.

1:31:10 Adam Well, not withdrawal. He's going to keep doing it.

1:31:12 Drew Yeah, but he's going to be recovering for a week or two. Well, you're getting a little little little. You know, you're getting opiates. It'll block the withdrawal.

1:31:18 Caller Yeah, here's the quote, yeah, I was motivated thinking about a month, so I just, you know, I thought, oh, all right, then I'll worry about it.

1:31:24 Adam But here's the thing. Thanks, John. Good luck to you. Call us back. Tell us how it goes. Yeah. Yeah, here's the. Yeah.

1:31:33 Caller What's been the last two minutes trying to wake up BJ?

1:31:41 Adam Trying to wake up BJ is like telling a chick her boob is hanging out of her bikini top. Why do it? Well, we got a nice eyeful right now. You know what I mean? I mean, this is a train. We got to ride. You see what I'm saying, Drew?

1:31:56 Drew Let's just enjoy it for the last 10 seconds here.

1:31:58 Adam To BJ's credit, normally they wake up and God knows where the earpiece is on the phone because I hope it actually sounds like he swallows the phone.

1:32:12 Drew I hope that's where it is.

1:32:13 Adam The mouthpiece is. The mouthpiece is near the mouth, right?

1:32:18 Drew I hope so.

1:32:18 Adam Where could the earpiece be? It must have slid down, right? Or could he hear us?

1:32:22 Drew He could hear us, probably.

1:32:26 Caller We've got to take a break.

1:32:28 Adam We're going to get back. When we come back, before we wrap it up, we'll check in with BJ after this.

1:32:33 Guest Okay, so I know there's nothing wrong with me. So what's up?

1:32:38 Guest Why can't I meet anybody? I'm looking to 877-889-DATE.

1:32:52 Guest 1-800-LOVE-191.

1:32:54 Guest You're listening to Live 105.

1:33:06 Adam Well, that's the show, everybody. BJ potted up Anderson.

1:33:11 Guest Yes, he is.

1:33:13 Guest It's alive, it's good.

1:33:15 Drew May I see a biped monsieur?

1:33:21 Guest Force some oxygen into those lungs.

1:33:25 Adam Yeah, David Alan Greer in here tomorrow night. I hope BJ makes it till tomorrow night, though. So, until next time, it's Adam Carolla for Dr. Drew saying, mahalo.

1:33:39 Guest Nobody's my hero except for Jesus.

1:33:45 Guest This has been Loveline. Opinions expressed in this show are not necessarily those of the staff, management, sponsors or this station. The producer for Loveline is Ann Ingold. Loveline is a presentation of Westwood One Entertainment.

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Tuesday, June 15, 2004